I obviously did not know my Great Grandparents as they had died before I was born but Teddy and Bunty always spoke so lovingly of them and as I have so many photos of them I thought I should include a post about them with what information I have gleaned over the years. I do know that Teddy was extremely fond of her Grandparents.
George James 1852-1936
George was born in Pitcombe – a tiny village in Somerset. Mary and I went down there in 2007 to have a look at the various places that our ancestors had lived and we had a great few days together. We visited Pitcombe church and found that the engineer from the Titanic is also buried in the churchyard there.
George was the son of Benjamin James (1829-1905) an agricultural labourer and Ann James nee Courtney (1831-1909) who was born in Yarlington, Somerset to Robert Courtney (1800-1878) an agricultural labourer and his wife, Ann born in 1831. They married on 5th December 1850.
At age 19, in 1871, George is already working on the railways and is a railway porter, lodging at 28 Bath Place, Shornhill, Finsbury. He and Emma married three years later in August 1874 at St Pauls, Bedford.
ST PAUL’S BEDFORD, WHERE GEORGE AND EMMA WERE MARRIED IN 1874
I would love to know how they met but am rather inclined to think that he was transferred to Bedford for his work as Bedford is only a few stations from Aspley Guise, where Emma Hirdle lived.
George was the eldest child born in 1852 and was followed by
- Charles James born 1854. Charles was living at home in the 1871 census, aged 16 and a scholar. I have just found that he married Sarah Craddock at St Peters Church, Birmingham and on the marriage certificate he is described as a “Rule lawyer” so obviously he did well for himself.
- Thomas James was born in 1860, also in Pitcombe. Thomas became a carpenter and married Emma Sophie Bowring in 1895. They had a son ,Lewis, in 1887 and a daughter, Gertrude, in 1890.
- A daughter, Elizabeth, was born in 1863 in Discove an area near Pitcombe. She married Harry Crocker on 27th December 1890 at St Andrew-Montpelier, Bristol
- A fourth son, Nathaniel, (1868-1937) was born in Discove. Nathaniel was still living at home with his parents in 1891 aged 23 and appears to have been an agricultural labourer, like his father. He married Julia Elizabeth J Sugg in 1894 and they then had five children: Charles in 1896, May in 1898, George in 1901, Bertie in 1905 and Richard in 1908.
- A fifth son, Harry, born in 1870 in Discove. Harry became an agricultural labourer and in 1901 was working at Lamyat, Shepton Mallet, and in 1911 at Headsmen nr Castle Cary. Harry married Annie Russ in 1892 in Glamorganshire and they had six children: Annie in 1892, William in 1893, Frank in 1896, Florence in 1899, Albert in 1903 and Alice in1906.
Emma James nee Hirdle 1855-1941
Emma was born in Aspley Guise in 1855 to Robert Hirdle (1819-1868), a livery man and Hannah Hirdle nee Lane ( died in 1858). I am assuming that Hannah died in childbirth as the last child, Samuel, was born and died in 1858 the same year as Hannah.
Robert and Hannah married in 1847 in Newport Pagnell, Buckinghamshire, Robert was a labourer.
Emma was the fifth child of the marriage. Her siblings were:
- Edward Andrew Hirdle 1848-1917. Edward married Annie Coll and died in Yorkshire
- John Hirdle born 1849. I am not sure what happened to John. I cannot find any definite proof of him but have found a death at sea in 1880 which could possibly be him as he was born in the right year and place but the surname is spelled Hurdle. The spelling of names in those days changed quite often as they had so little schooling.
- Alice Hirdle 1852-1884. Alice married Thomas Fellows, a railway yard foreman, and they had two children, a daughter Sushana in 1877 and a son William in 1874
- Charles Hirdle 1853-1884. Charles married Louisa Jane Spray in 1879 at St Saviour, Southwark. Charles was either a doorman or foreman ( I am unable to read the census clearly) and died in 1884 so Louisa then worked as a charlady. Louisa died in 1914
- Emma Hirdle – our Great Grandmother
- Frederick James Hirdle 1857-1859
- Samuel Hirdle 1858-1858
The Hirdle family were a large local family and I have found quite a lot of information about various members of the family. The most well known person appears to be a cousin of Emma, Alfred Hirdle, 1852-1900 who appears to have been an alcoholic and who several times appears to have been jailed for his drinking and finally died in prison. The newspaper reported the following:-
The Easter quarter of 1883 introduced us to the character of Alfred Hirdle. Alfred was married to Sarah and appeared in court charged with a violent assault on his wife. She had taken a warrant out against him and in revenge he broke into their house in the early hours of the morning. He went to his wife’s bedroom and violently hit her about the head with a stick. He was sentenced to 5 year penal servitude.
Cases of assault appear regularly in the Quarter sessions, but we were curious to see if he was still with his wife at the time of the next census. A little investigation saw that the couple had only been married approaching 4 years at the time of the attack. It’s likely his wife knew the type of man she was marrying, as Alfred had been convicted (mostly of drunkenness) over 20 times before they married. He was only 27. He was even in trouble on the night of the 1871 census, being listed as a prisoner at Woburn police station.
“Alfred Hirdle eventually passed away, whilst serving a sentence in Bedford Prison in 1900, aged 49. The doctors said cause of death was ‘Profound Disturbance of the Brain and Apoplexy’. Hirdle was infamous in the area, as his total of 59 convictions, mostly for being ‘Drunk and Disorderly’ bear testimony. Every landlord for miles around must have breathed a quiet sigh of relief!”
He sounds quite a character but fortunately the rest of the family are very law abiding.
Ten years later in the 1881 census, George and Emma are living at 20 Battison Street in Bedford with their two sons, Charles Edward aged 6, George W aged 4 and our Grandmother Alice aged 8 months.
Mary and I visited Battison Street and found the house there. We took a photo of number 18 and 20 as the James family had moved to the one next door in a later census.
In 1891 they were living at 6 Prebend Street, photographed below, with Charles, George, Alice and now Alice’s two sisters, Annie as she is called in the census aged 8 and Florence aged 5
6 Prebend Street, Bedford
A further ten years later, in the 1901 census, the sons have both left home and Emma and George just have their three daughters living with them but by the time another ten years have passed Alice and Annie are not at home, although Florence is there with her husband Harold Ernest Gough. Emma and George also have a lodger living with them who is a commercial traveller.
George worked for the Midland Railway from 1871 until at least 1908 and he earned 30s a week. I have a copy of some of his employment records and one record dated 1908 where he appears to have been in a slight accident on the railway resulting in him having facial cuts and bruised knees. His weekly wage at that time was £1 13s 0d.I am unable to find where either Alice Maud or Annie were on the night of the 1911 census.
I have been unable to find where Charles is living in 1901 but have found George and he is working as a hotel waiter and lodging in West Derby. George eventually married and lived in that area for the rest of his life and ran the Stork Hotel in Liverpool. I will post a photo of the Stork Hotel in the gallery of George James 2nd.
George and Emma do appear to have moved around a lot. We have a lovely photo of Emma at the Bell in Hendon where they lived. I have no idea what date it was taken but looking at the style of dress I imagine it must be about 1910 or later
I wonder if they moved to Hendon as Alice Maud and family were there. I believe that Alice and Alexander moved there about 1921 from Ireland and by that time George would have been aged about 68 or 69 and so retired. We are sure that they lived in Hendon as in notes from Jean we have the following:
The Lodge
This was the double fronted gatehouse of the Asylum. On one side was the Lodge and a pond. On the other side was a doctor. The Catholic church was to the right and the library was to the left. On the right after the church were almshouses. This was opposite the end of the Lodge grounds. Old Hendon Church was on the left round the corner.
Crossroads. To one side the horse pond, now railed. A war memorial, a convent, before getting to the library etc if going from school and the Daniel Place area.
They appear from this to have lived at two houses – the Bell and the Lodge. It is possible that some of the attached photos of the two of them in a garden are at one of these homes.
Mary had this lovely photo of George with his son and Grandson both called George
From left, Emma with baby George, Charles, George, Clara and GeorgeThe do seem to have come to Broadstairs a lot from all the photographs of them as they got older.
George died in Broadstairs in 1936 but according to memos he and Emma are both buried in the churchyard at Aspley Guise.
Emma died in 1941 and her death is registered in Bedford so it is possible that she was living with Flo and Alice as they had a house in Whitbread Avenue, Bedford.
George and Emma had five children having:
- A son Charles Edward James in 1875 – a year after they married.
Charles married May Victoria Derbyshire in 1905 when he was aged 30. According to the 1911 census Charles was living at 4 Grafton Road, Bedford with his wife, May, daughters Doris and Marjorie aged 4 &3 and a son called George aged 1. Also with them is May’s mother, Christiania aged 74. May died in 1943 and Charles in 1948 at the age of 73.
Emma with Florence and Emma’s son, Charles with his wife Clara and possibly his son
Emma, Charles and his wife Victoria———
- A second son, George William James in 1877. He was baptised on 11th January 1878
George William, according to the 1901 census was boarding in Edge Hill St Jude Lancashire and working as a hotel waiter. He married Clara Gill in 1903. It would appear that they had a son in 1901, a couple of years before they married,
I found that George and Clara were, at one stage, running the Stork Hotel in Liverpool and have found this early photo of it.
They had 8 children:-
- Emmanuel born 23rd January 1901 and baptised 10th February 1901 a couple of years before they got married. I have not heard about this son from any relative and can find nothing more about him on the web so am not sure what happened to him.
- 2/ They then had a second son, George, born 29th June 1903 and baptised on 6th January 1904. This George was a great favourite of my mother and there are several photos of them on the beach and at Broadstairs. He married Sybella Voce in 1930 in West Derby. Sybella gave birth to twins in 1932 – a daughter Sybil, and a son, Arthur James. Sadly Sybella and Arthur both died during or shortly after childbirth.
- A daughter Hannah born 1905
- A second daughter Alice Maud in 1904 of whom I have some photos.
- A son called Stanley James born 1907
- A son called Norman Leslie born in 1908, Norman became a footballer and played for Liverpool in the early 1930’s. http://www.liverpoolfc.com/history/past-players/norman-james
- Marjorie James born in 1911 in Bootle, Liverpool. Marjorie and her brothers ,Joe and George, were fequent visitors to Broadstairs and I have quite a few photos of them.
- Finally a son, called Joe James, born in 1918.
My mother was always very fond of her cousins and I have a lot of photos of George and Clara’s children, in Broadstairs.
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- A daughter, Alice Maud James in 1881 – my Grandmother
https://www.judithbennett.co.uk/my-grandparents/
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- A second daughter Ann Elizabeth James in 1883
Ann Elizabeth, always known as Nan and sounds a rather unpleasant person. From notes we have, she gave Chick a pretty hard time when Chick and Alice were living with her after Alice and Alexander broke up. I also know that on my mother’s wedding day on April 1st 1939, she told my mother that her parents were not married. That was the first that Teddy knew about it and it certainly was not a good time to tell her that her father was already married to another woman before he met her mother and had six daughters!
Nan’s son, Geoffrey, was born with a shortened arm due to damage during the birth. I always understood that because of that and because of the way Nan treated him, he was always very shy of women and so never married.
Billy Rayner (Herbert William) was, I believe, an engineer. His son Geoffrey, worked for Tate & Lyle in Orpington, retiring at a very young age. He bought a cottage outside Taunton, intending to grow grapes to make his own wine as well as his own food. both Billy and Geoffrey were very tight with money. I gather that when the toll bridge was operating at Sandwich and one had to pay 6d to cross it, Billy would drive all round the villages in order to avoid paying the toll. He probably had to spend more than the toll in petrol! Geoffrey was the same.
Geoffrey used to come to stay with my parents each summer. He fell in love with the polyester duvet they had on his bed and decided to buy one for himself, but when he went to the local market he thought £14 was far too much to pay and he could make one. Geoffrey told us that it should have worked! When asked how he made it, it transpired that he had used two sheets joined together with clothes pegs and filled it with polystyrene S pieces of packing from a cardboard box!
Geoffrey did not believe on paying out to ride on a bus and walked everywhere – walking miles into Taunton and back. He took home anything he found and once he found a box of eggs fallen off a lorry. He took them home and found some cracked and some whole. This was in August and we found that he was still eating them in November!
Hugh and I went down to see him in Somerset as he was apparently selling his home and we had a feeling that he was being cheated. That was an experience! The place was such a mess. His bedroom ceiling had fallen down and he had so much stored in the room that you could not really open the door. As a result, he was sleeping on a sofa in the hall. His wardrobe was a stepladder on which he hung his clothes. He had taken the dividing wall down so that the kitchen and lounge were one room but had left posts up. He had taken so much rubbish back on his walks that only about a foot of clear floor round a table was left to walk on. He sat at the table (with just enough space for a plate) to watch the TV. Hugh and I decided that under no circumstances were we eating or drinking a thing there. I went ahead with Geoffrey to see the place, leaving Hugh free to take photographs which I will now add here.
Geoffrey, did move into digs in Broadstairs for the last few years of his life and died in Margate hospital in 1992.
When he died, Geoffrey left £621,485. Such a shame he did not spend some of his money and enjoy himself more or travel and see something of the world.
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- A third daughter Florence Mary James in 1886.
Florence married Ernest Gough (born in 1879 in Hackney) in the fourth quarter of 1905 when she was aged 19. She appears to have given birth to a daughter, Ivy Violet Gough in Chelsea in the third quarter of that year. Ivy died in the middle of 1906. In the 1911 census, Harold is living with George, Emma and Florence in Bedford and is described as a Marine Surgeon Port London. Florence gave birth to a son Harold E. Gough who was born and died in 1915. I have since been told that her husband had a venereal disease which caused his death at the age of 41 on 1st June 1920 and is probably the reason that neither child lived. When he died, Harold left £295 14s 2d to his wife which would be about £14000 nowadays.
Florence was a kindly soul and she had Alice Maud to live with her. They lived together at 29 Whitbread Avenue, Bedford before becoming too frail.
Florence was living at Upton on Severn with Bunty and Alfred when she died in 1959 and is buried in St Peters Churchyard with Alice and Alexander.
And the next generation is Teddy